The Price of Being Passionate with Dr. Mary Hemphill

The Price of Being Passionate with Dr. Mary Hemphill

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dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Alright, folks, welcome back to the Exit interview podcast for black educators with me, your host, Dr. Asia. It's good to be back in the recording seat. Um, and I have someone special with me today, Dr. Mary Hemphill. We met at FETC this, uh, January. Shout out to the folks at FETC to Jennifer Womble, who was the one who got me to the conference.

And so she is here today to share her story. Welcome to the show.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: Thank you so much for having me. When I say honored, I cannot wait to dive into this conversation.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah, we, we kind of started talking at the conference sharing a little bit of your story. I, I put some of your, uh, clip on our social media folks Went wild. They love you out [00:01:00] there. And so I was so excited to get this, uh, podcast episode recorded. So let's just, uh, dive right in and.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: it.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Folks, before I even start, you gotta follow on LinkedIn, you gotta get on the Instagram.

She's out here everywhere. But let's start off with the very beginning.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: Yeah.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: What was the decision that helped you decide, or the situation that you wanted to go into? Education, and what was that journey like for you?

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: Ooh. So when I say being in education was an honor in and of itself, because Asia, you know, we talk a lot about generational patterns or breaking generational curses. I. What I don't think we talk enough about is what happens when education is in your bloodline and you have people setting the bar with each shift of the generation.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: from a long line of educators, um, in New York, and when I say public school, 38 or public school, [00:02:00] 79, these are community. True community schools where I grew up hearing nothing other than you do the right thing for your students because you are going to church with these individuals and

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah. Mm-hmm.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: You do the right thing for these individuals because your father, who may have passed on, did business with this other person's father, and they made a call. What we forget is that there were already these intricate networks that had clout before we got here, and so I felt a calling to pick up the mantle and to continue in education even though neither one of my biological parents were in education. My aunts, my grandmother was not an educator in the formal sense, but she was the educator of the community. She was the Sunday school superintendent. So when I have at age three, four, and five, when I set up my dolls, my care bearers [00:03:00] in little seats. And I start giving them spelling tests. When I say it was so epigenetic to me to be like, okay, no care bear, you are not spelling that word right?

Like I heard the language of education

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: so it was an honor for me to go into this work. when I had the opportunity to be a third grade and fourth grade teacher in the same classroom I had been a student in, I didn't take that lightly. I.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: You know, they, they asked me, they said, what school do you want to go to?

When I started applying, and of course I applied in my hometown, not knowing if I was going back, not knowing any of those, those things. And there was a list, the superintendent at the time had a list of vacancies, and this was spring break. So these were all the people who were either going to resign, retire, move on, whatnot. And I see Southwest Elementary School. [00:04:00] And I see the name of my third grade teacher in the middle of the list.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Mm,

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: And Asia, you know when people say, if it's your calling, it'll keep calling till you pick up the

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: that's right.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: It was almost like I couldn't, I couldn't not pick up the phone. I couldn't not answer this call.

I couldn't say, oh no, I'm gonna go to another school. I stepped back into the same classroom that my third grade teacher had met me in after 38 years. She pulled me aside that summer because I was coming in, she was packing up and she said, my husband told me that these 38 years of materials and resources and workbooks don't have a home in our garage.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Mm. Uhhuh.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: She said, and I told him that is perfectly okay. I am seeding that into you and I'm leaving [00:05:00] everything for you to be able to do this work. So

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yes. Yeah.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: to have students sitting in a classroom and now I'm not in the desk, I'm at the front of the room. But on the binders and on sticky tape and on post-it notes within all these materials that I'm using to create learning environments and engagement, 15, 16 years later, felt It felt full circle.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: But what I also got to do in those third and fourth grade classrooms was to tell my students. I played in the same parks you played in, sat in the same seats you've been in, and by this time Asia, I was graduated from college. I had studied abroad in Puerto Rico for a year as an exchange student.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: So she just showing out right quick for us [00:06:00] folks. She ain't have to do that. She ain't have to hit us with the. She, she didn't have to do that. Right. I just, go ahead. Just go ahead. Leave us. Just go.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: tell you why that's so important. Asia being a double major in education and Spanish

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: that my community looked different than it did when I was there a

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: of color. I was always aware of what it looked like, felt like, and sounded like to be othered. So going and majoring in Spanish. Yes, I had taken it in high school, but was always required.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah. That's just what it is.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: that's just what we do. But I knew that if I acquired the Spanish language, like immersed myself in the culture as an A IG student who had been labeled academically, intellectually gifted, to Puerto Rico and enrolling in classes [00:07:00] to where I had to pass to graduate I had to find a tutor. I. I had to learn how to ask for help meant I had to draft my concepts and my talks and all the different classes and things beforehand, and I had never been in a position to have to do it. But what it elevated for me when I got back and graduated and walked into that school was asking my principal, give me every Spanish speaking student and family in the third grade. Because I wanted to show them that their language was not a barrier, it was an asset.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yes.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: And that families who are raising students from backgrounds of indigenous backgrounds, Hispanic backgrounds, the diaspora of what we think about when we look at the 23 levels of unconscious bias, seniority, marital status, all of that, even in the [00:08:00] Spanish culture, me understanding machismo. I didn't have educational conversations with a mother and father unless I bit my body language and directed it at the father so that he understood that there was still that level of respect. And culturally that wasn't happening in our school because family and education is deeply rooted in communities where you're raising students of color. Every single one of my babies for three years, and I looped them the last year, meaning I took 'em from

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: passed despite the fact that some of them literally came to the country weeks before they enrolled in my classroom.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Hold that thought.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: Yes.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: so many little t there's so many tidbits. I have a few things. The first thing is kind of going back to this being in the same classroom as your third grade teacher, Dr. [00:09:00] Uh, Adrian Davenport was on a few episodes back and she talked about this, that her teacher, when she was in fourth grade, became her mentor teacher when she went back to the same school.

And so there is this way that people find their, their themselves back in the communities that they were raised in.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: Yes.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Right and find that a value to be and the schools, or be as close as they can be to that community so they can continue to serve and support the community that helped to raise them. And so I love hearing that story and I'm so glad that, that there are so many of us out there who continue to go back to those districts and the schools that had supported them along the way.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: yes,

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: Asia, it is, it's, it's part of our history. But it is part of our responsibility

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: income wise were other options. There's lots of options for those [00:10:00] other individuals as well, wise. There's other options, but I feel like it's those educators who went back that now are reaping the benefits of the commitment.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: The responsibility to go back and say, I came from where you came from. There's more out there than they're showing you, than they're exposing you to, they're offering you. So give them the language to advocate for themselves and give the people connected to them to advocate for the babies that they love.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah. Yeah. Then this helps me think about the or. This brings me to the second point I wanted to make is, as you're talking, I'm thinking about all of the. The work and all the intention that you put into your classroom before you even got into your own classroom. Right? That you're thinking about your future students and their families and their communities.

And obviously you didn't know exactly where you're gonna be, but you knew that you wanted to be as, [00:11:00] um, supportive as possible to as many communities as possible, knowing that your city or area, your town that you kind of wanted to be in was changing and that you weren't afraid of that. Right? And that's so important.

And so when we talk about on the show, folks transitioning to different positions or leaving education altogether, this is the kind of folks that we're losing, right?

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: Um,

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: that folks who are thinking about our children long before they see our children, and it is not that they just happen to have this position position.

Uh, this is where they ended up, but there was intentionality from, from the very beginning as to how they wanted to show up in a space to bring value to a community. And so I just wanted to point those two things out.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: that's huge. And oh, I love how you position that. Those are the people we're losing

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: and it's. it's sad because every single person I [00:12:00] feel like who, who has left or who I've had the honor to share space with, said they have to sit down and weigh the pros and cons of staying in your home to prophesy future that's possible or to go into a world where there's strangers to talk about why that prophecy matters. It's he. It's like, what do you choose?

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Well, even Jesus said you can't do miracles in your own land.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: say it.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: and so for some of us it is to transition to something else that go somewhere else. And we, we are not done talking about your story, but I just did wanna pause on those two points of all of the work it took.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: Yeah.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Right? All of the, the, the putting yourself in, like you said, I'm gifted, things come to me easy.

Never had the strain, and I'm putting myself in a position to struggle. [00:13:00] Seeing, understanding the end goal is gonna be so much more valuable. Right. Then this like temporary challenge. Uh, so you taught third grade. Tell us more about that journey.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: Yeah, so I taught third grade loop my babies up to fourth, and I did that for five years before I realized there was such a mentorship gap. I. And what I wanted to do in terms of the impact and I, what I meant was I wanted to do more outside my classroom. I wanted to be able to help bts. I wanted to be able to help veteran teachers think differently about what's possible. And as a classroom teacher, your locus of control. small when it comes to what you can impact. Yes, you're

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: students and their families and communities, but D school-wide, district-wide, unless you are just the type of educator who can [00:14:00] navigate that balance. But Asia, that takes years,

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah, it does.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: that takes years.

And so I immediately decided that I wanted to go into administration. And I apply for an in, uh, a, a administration role, and I get placed in a high school.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: And you had been elementary all these years.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: Okay. you for pointing that out because when I say

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: We all have our favorites and high school was not mine. So I'm, I want to hear how this worked out. I want to hear this transition. Yeah.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: I would have no qualms in saying. I literally was hiding in my office for about a week because these big children, they, they have a vocabulary I'm not used to.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: have a way of um, just dismantling a little bit. [00:15:00] Like you, when I say in an elementary school, when you walk into the cafeteria and you're that teacher, you're gonna feel the love, you're gonna feel the feels.

You're

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Listen.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: woo.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Hold on. Come on. That teacher. Come on. That teacher.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: Okay.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: when popular do yes.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: Popular. Okay. Like, right,

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Right?

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: we're here.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: I don't want people to think popular in terms of like, um, uh, something or something that's unfounded. I'm talking about the clout to be, to stop a student in their track with a look.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah, that part, the warm demander, the

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: the cultural, um, value to say now that you've taught years of students that the big brothers like, don't play in Ms. Hemphill's class. that's what I'm talking about

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Dr. Mary. We, Dr. Mary, I wish we would've been teaching together. We would've been shutting it down

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: shut it down.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: [00:16:00] before I, I, hold on. So let me ask you. Well, yeah. Let me ask you this question before you continue just backing up a little bit. They call you, they say high school, you said? Yes.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: I said yes.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: tell me before you finish the story about this part. Why did you,

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: So

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: did you say yes?

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: let me tell you, and I, I love this question in, in all things, this is what I will say that my parents did for me was they gave me the power of two things. gave me the power of words and language. Based in and life, or in the power of the tongue. So they always, from the moment my mom found out she was pregnant, they spoke life into me,

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: But the second thing, and this came from my dad, he always would say, when you ask better questions, you get better answers. So [00:17:00] instead of me growing up in a way of thinking, what's gonna happen in third grade when I'm in second grade, or what's gonna happen in high school when I'm in middle school? I always thought long term, what if I position myself now for my five year from now self? I always knew I wanted to be in education. And so when I got to teacher, I was like, okay, let me look at the climate. Let me look at the landscape. And what I know, I will not always be teaching teachers,

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Mm-hmm.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: every student who comes in my classroom is not gonna wanna be an educator, which is why I went to Meredith, which was a private institution Western, which was a public institution and a and t, which was A-H-B-C-U, because my end game to be a superintendent and I needed to understand the landscape of public, private, and A-H-B-C-U. that I understood the realities of the teachers coming to me, the communities coming to me, and be able to [00:18:00] speak to students' futures. So I said yes to high school because I had done elementary and as a superintendent, what have I heard my whole career? Oh yeah, they're superintendent, but never been in the classroom. Oh yeah, they're the director of elementary school, but they came from middle. People love gaps.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Mm-hmm.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: I decided early in my career. To have fewer gaps, which gave people less excuses to try to dismantle me professionally. So I wanted elementary, middle, and I wanted high. And I think that that thinking Asia comes from not only being raised as a woman of color, but being raised by two parents who grew up during segregation.

My dad was born in 1936. My mom was born in the fifties.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Mm-hmm.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: when it comes to civil rights, when it comes to autonomy, when it comes to women's rights, when it comes to all of these structures, how they trained, [00:19:00] my sister and I, how they taught, my sister and I always was not, what's the next step? What are the five steps ahead of this that positioned you to be in this space? I wanted to do the whole K 12 continuum so that when I got wherever I was going. can speak to the realities

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah. Thank you. Thank you. I, I appreciate that. And that makes so much sense. And again, that speaks to the Spanish. You know, that speaks to lots of things and it speaks to your work right now. Um, but continue, you were in high school, you were hiding in the office,

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: I'm in the

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: you said? Yes. And now you in the office hiding

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: and now I'm cowering down. I'm just like, oh my goodness. I will say is that high school gave me the end of the story that I had no clue existed.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: mm-hmm.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: had third and fourth graders who were graduating and moving on, and I know that I did my best. there things that I would go back now and be like, I cannot [00:20:00] believe I had a word wall.

Like there's just things that happen, right?

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Or timed multiplication tests,

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: or rote

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: uh, spelling test. No. I

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: Ooh.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: you. If you forgive me.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: So thank you for the grace. Thank you for the grace.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yes.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: But what I had not banked on was I was the disciplinarian, or I was the administrator over the sophomores at the time. I had a sophomore student who had walked onto the football team from eighth grade. So when, when I say walked on, like he. don't even have to try out. You are it. Your career is set for you in the NFL. But he gets a writeup and he comes to my office and this is my first disciplinary act, right? So I'm got the student handbook and I'm like, okay, this is what you've done, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Young man of color. And [00:21:00] he says to me, Miss Hemphill. I, I don't understand. I, I thought that I was doing the right thing because all my coach said was that I just needed to show up. Me not being able to read my textbook has never been an issue. I'm sorry, what? This young man, sophomore in high school was not able to comprehend. textbook, not able to understand. vocabulary was not able to break down word problems, was not able to do it, but he had been given a pass because he was a star football player. What I saw was who did not do what they were supposed to do elementary school and

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Mm-hmm.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: it this far with not having the understanding of, if we're telling you you are going to the NFL and you're [00:22:00] not able to read the contract. That is a problem.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: That's a problem for

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah. Mm-hmm.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: And so while I was the administrator over student services for one year, I made sure that I let it be known that I wanted to be the administrator over curriculum and instruction. Because oftentimes in high school, there's this notion. I'm not a reading teacher, I'm an AP biology teacher, I'm a math teacher, or I'm a social studies or history teacher.

I don't teach reading. We work for two years to find ways to ensure that not just athletes, but students across the diaspora of extracurricular stem dance, whatever. the opportunity for literal reading, tutoring, and I don't mean reading yes, in the context, but I mean breaking it down. What's, what are the phone names? What are the, what is the shared reading? I want you to do all [00:23:00] these things because what we had to figure out was how to do this and keep their dignity

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah. Yeah, I was gonna say that that had to have been so difficult because one of the challenges and um. Joy Osborne De Lizzo Osborne was on the, she was also on the podcast. And her work now is helping students become engaged in reading when they're past third, fourth grade. Right? And like that is very difficult to keep that integrity, that, excuse me, their dignity intact.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: Yes.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: we're starting from scratch in a lot of things. And that balance, right, that balance, so that they are successful is so, so challenging. Yeah.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: And it's, and it's not only, it's not that we had to do so much to prepare ourself for the students. We had to prepare ourself for the teachers

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: I believe you.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: one thing all, all a teacher would have to say is one thing. [00:24:00] It, you would see that child's dignity. You would see that child's hope just disintegrating. you're, you're a senior and you can't,

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: mm.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: not on my watch. And so that took time because that was a community mindset that had to shift. And I kept saying, why are you reporting scores based on students who don't have the base level? Understanding to not only decode this high level, highly contextual vocabulary and understanding, especially in biology and some of these science and math courses, and the gap was that we had students who had STEM proclivity, but because they had been oversaturated and overrepresented with special education labels, they never got access to the ap.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: never got access to the [00:25:00] honors classes.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: yeah. Yeah.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: So you can imagine that's a heavy lift for me because what I'm coming from is a self-contained classroom everybody has access to me. I have some locus of control over their learning a system that not only wasn't ready for that conversation, but oftentimes did not intend on changing the system that students would get the help.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: S, and that was my question. I'm thinking about these conversations that you're having. I cannot imagine the tension.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: Trust me, the tension, and, and here's the piece that we don't talk about enough, is that the tension your supervisory executive leader level, meaning your other aps and your principals is very different than the tension between you and the superintendent. Which is different than the tension that's created between the superintendent and the board, [00:26:00] and then the tension that's created between you and the community when you're trying to tell somebody's football baby that he can't read

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: and that you will be setting him up to fail you don't get on board with us getting him help.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: And what state is this? Tell tell us the city, state, where are you in this context?

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: this is in North Carolina?

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Okay.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: Yeah, this is in North Carolina.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: a community Asia that was low socioeconomic at the time, I believe we were 80 to 85% free and reduced lunch. And when I say that, I'm talking about from the feeder pattern of the elementary, middle high, and it was a football town.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: So this is people's way out. This is PE family's way, time, meal ticket. It's their way to get to be someone. And at in the future [00:27:00] and in the current, my child's a start. They're getting stopped at the store. They're getting handshakes, they're getting free stuff. They're getting the recognition that the Ooh, yeah,

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: And, and by proximity, you are also a

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: exactly. Exactly. You're the mom of, you're the, everybody has matching hoodies and the thing that,

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: Hmm. And

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: I.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: when that child goes off to college, you still to the point Asia, there was a section in the stadium where the moms and the dads of the athletes would sit, even if your baby had graduated 10 years ago.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Wow. So you just coming in here flipping tables over?

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: And I'm like, boop, absolutely.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah,

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: But, but coming from a place of, again, going back to my thinking, I'm thinking about that child five years from

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: of course. Yeah, of course.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: is run off, run up, or heaven forbid, injury. Heaven forbid, [00:28:00] I don't know, change of season. He wakes up. He doesn't wanna play football anymore, he doesn't wanna do basketball anymore. They don't wanna play lacrosse, soccer,

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: the whole continuum of sports. And if they don't wanna dance anymore, they don't wanna do united, uh, nations or debate team anymore, it we're talking about sports, but it applies to everything.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Sure.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: When you challenge what the parent has aspired in their head and said, this is something that's not about what I feel. This is something about what I know. And without this knowledge, without this skill, without this information, the level and ceiling that you've created, they will only get here because the gap is in you doing the hard thing now.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Mm-hmm.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: And that's hard for parents. That's hard for community members. hard for school [00:29:00] leaders who have this professional persona. And when you challenge that, that comes with tension, comes with labels, and

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Mm.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: to navigate that.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah. And how long did you do that particular work? How long did you I mean, fight the good faith of faith, I guess I would call it.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: fight the good fight. I fought the good fight as an AP and as a principal because after that I became a principal of turnaround school. Always turnaround schools. Four, eight years.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Wow.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: Eight years, three years at that high school, and five years as a principal doing turnaround work. Um, in low socioeconomic, uh, populations and communities, schools that always look like the school I came from

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Sure.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: in [00:30:00] communities that desperately needed change.

So when I would get a call or be was recruited, it was always the

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: That's where you gotta go. So obviously the work that you did as an ap, someone, someone found value in that, saw the work that you were doing,

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: Yeah.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: the success you had, and maybe some of the challenges that you had and said, we want you these other places.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: Mm-hmm.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: and you said, all turnaround schools, listen, tough,

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: Yes.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: and c And for folks who are listening who don't know what a turnaround school is, can you define it for us or give an an example?

I.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: So a school and turnaround is what I typically call school in crisis. And so they could be in crisis academically, meaning students are not hitting achievement levels at a dismal rate. The bulk of students are not on grade level. You can have a school that's in crisis culturally. Meaning you may have great teachers, you may have [00:31:00] awesome curriculum, but the culture is so stagnant, or the culture's so toxic that nothing can grow.

Students can't grow, teachers can't grow. It's really hard to have an environment, and then you can have a school that's in crisis when it comes to just engagement and efficacy, meaning they've tried a lot of things. Maybe they've had a long stream of. School leaders and with that comes just changing expectations and whatnot.

And so sometimes that school that is in crisis from the latter, they are in need of stability. They are in need of clarity. so regardless of why, how, why the school is in turnaround. It is for you to fill the gap. It is for you to get things connected, get systems out sometimes, and put new systems in so that things can get moving.

So ultimately students can learn.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Thank you. Thank you. And so after your, your time as an [00:32:00] AP and a a principal, what was the next step for you? Where did you go after that?

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: The State Department. And Asia. I tell this story all the time that this journey after the principalship was not on my vision board,

France, Stacey, Taylor, Brandon and I are coming to you with something new. It's called Podcast and Pause, an Unbook Club for black educators. So instead of a traditional book, what we're gonna be doing is talking through episodes from the exit interview, a podcast for black educators, and then in our sessions and our time together, we're gonna also be talking about wellness.

And healing practices that black folks in education can use to be well, this is open to paraprofessionals, admins, school psychs, teachers, professors, folks who support youth in any [00:33:00] capacity. We love to see you there.

So make sure that you check us out. Alright, peace.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: was the vision that God had for me. I'm on vacation. I'm in Cancun, um, for Christmas. It's a few days before Christmas. I literally wanna say it was probably a day or two before Christmas Eve, and I'm trying to get a signal out just to let my family know I've landed.

I'm good. Can't get a signal. I looked down, it's a 9 1 9 number. Raleigh. It's the lieutenant Governor at the time with his educational, uh, leader, director, and their committee. He says this, Dr. Mary Hemphill. 'cause I had graduated my PhD by that time. I said, yes, this. This is she, um, he says, Hey, this is Lieutenant Governor, um, and one of the directors from Educational Oversight Committee. We are about to put computer science into all schools across the state [00:34:00] that will impact 1.9 million children, and we want you to come to Raleigh and lead that work.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: No application

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: No application,

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: folks. Listen. Just phone calls. Boop. Listen. I mean, Cancun toes out and nails done. Toes done. Large sun hats

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: Okay.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: And now we talking.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: in hand. I was ready to vacation. Okay.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Okay.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: what I did? Do you know what I said

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: No, let me think about it. Or no, thank you.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: I said, I think you have the wrong number. I,

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Oh,

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: am

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: the man said your whole name.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: said my whole what? He might as well have called my social okay. Security number. I said, I thank you. I am not a computer scientist.

'cause all I'm hearing is Computer Science

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yes. Yes.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: Asia. That is nowhere in my repertoire. [00:35:00] that's nowhere in my bank. And he said, I'm gonna stop you right there. He said, I do not want you because you're a computer scientist. I want you because you are a problem solver. I want you because you transform spaces I want you because you're not afraid of the hard work. And he said something to me that knew in theory had never experienced in reality. He said, we've been following your career.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Mm.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: And he said, you never run away from the hard environments. You don't run away when you're met with a school that is in crisis or needs transformation. He says, and everywhere you've gone, you've impacted change. And that's what we need in Raleigh. And I said, okay, let me, let me think about it. He said, I'll be in [00:36:00] touch January 2nd. I, I get back to the states. January 2nd, I sit down at my desk. I was a middle school principal at the time. We had just started one of the, a continuation of the first stem magnet programs, which brought an affluent community together with a community of poverty,

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Mm.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: blended them together to increase access. at my desk, I get a call January 2nd, he said, what time can you come for an interview?

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Wait. That that's not, he didn't, he didn't waste no time. He said, happy New Year. Ring ring.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: Happy New Year. Put your resolutions to the side

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: of you. Asia. I was, I think it was April. I had to make a decision because the work had to start in June because they were gonna be bringing the Big 10 together. So IBM, SaaS, Lenovo, Microsoft, they were doing all of these things to get ready for this pipeline and bringing computer science.

There had not been new standards in the state [00:37:00] in 20 years,

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Mm.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: me to develop a state of, a set of statewide standards for not only computer science, but also artificial intelligence, cybersecurity machine, and virtual learning. All of which, by the way, were foreign concepts to

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Mm-hmm. Yeah.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: And that was this one of the, out of the five dec, one of the best decisions I've ever made in my life. Um, leaving the school was hard. I.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah, of course.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: Leaving the community was hard because where I had looped my third and fourth graders, I looped my fifth graders when my superintendent sent me to the middle school. So I brought my fifth graders, their families in the community over to the middle school and there was, you know, there was trust there.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah, of course.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: Moved to Raleigh, and in two and a half years we had the first set of statewide computer science standards and legislation and policy to back it up.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: [00:38:00] I guess he didn't have, I guess he didn't have the wrong number.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: he didn't, he didn't have the

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: He did not have the wrong number, folks.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: and and lemme tell. Thank you for that. And lemme tell you what that did for me that I didn't know I needed. One of the reasons I did not get an EDD was because I wanted to know the next thing about how people think about leadership, how people think about education. I did not realize that I had become comfortable in doing school. Like when you're in school your whole life, you grew up, you know how to do school,

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: know the systems, you my, my mom was on the school board for 14 years. Like when I say we are in this thing,

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: yeah. Yeah.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: were in it. We, we were good. I needed a beginner's mindset for my soul purpose. Being the [00:39:00] director of computer science for the state took me back to asking better questions, to positioning myself intentionally in the room so I could be quiet and learn. It gave me business acumen to watch these engineers and cybersecurity analysts and CEOs and business deals are done. Like that's not something you get as an educator. I learned the language of progression. I learned the language of the ask.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: When you go to somebody and you have to ask this big business. To support 10 internships for high school seniors, like I didn't have the opportunity. I was a beginner in my industry, again, in a very different place,

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: just sharpened me.

It challenged me because what? What did I even know about building statewide curriculum? Like I [00:40:00] had to learn and get up under people who knew way more than I did this happen. Best thing could have ever happened to me.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: I am so glad you're saying that because I often think about folks who 20 years in third grade, 14 years in the same classroom, same school,

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: Mm-hmm.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: and they have a fear of relearning, right? They don't know, how would I even start that? How would I know this thing? I don't know what to do. And you're saying, I just paid attention.

I was silent. I took notes, I ask questions. And I'm so glad that you're saying that because I know that there are lots of folks who wanna try something new, go to different places,

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: mm

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: and they just don't know how to get there.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: Yeah,

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: uh, I, and when they get there, what to do next. So I'm glad you're saying this.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: And, and Asia, I think there's. Yes, there was uncertainty.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah,

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: were days where it's like, okay, this was a [00:41:00] risk,

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: yeah,

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: but isn't that there with anything?

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: yeah,

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: What I did not want over the risk was the regret of being 85 and saying, why didn't I do that?

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: yeah. Absolutely.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: Or being, and this is when we think about education. I heard an amazing superintendent. I had the opportunity to go to the Off School Grounds Coalition two years ago, and I heard a phenomenal superintendent who said, you can be in education a long time and be ineffectual and not move from your position.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Mm-hmm.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: I did not wanna become that

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: 30 years, and I should have left 10 years ago, but I'm in it

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Comfortable.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: coasting.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yes.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: That's who wants a life of coasting.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: Like that's, I'm not impacting anything, nor am I reaching my potential. Denzel Washington said the, [00:42:00] when you see hearse, you have not lived out your full life, then there's a U-Haul behind that hearse with all the ideas, all the things. You didn't do all of the lives and you did not impact because you decided to stay comfortable.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah, that's right.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: I didn't want that. So, yeah, so being in this space, unknown, risky, it took courage. There were days where I was like, I'm going back to a school. Give me my classroom. Like this is comfortable. reward, though, you can't take those experiences from me. I'm the things I learned there and that's when I decided and realized I was becoming an entrepreneur.

Like all of the ed, the 20 years plus of education and this entrepreneurial mind that had been wanting to come out that had been, but I didn't have any [00:43:00] systems to where my entrepreneurial mind could show up

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah,

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: thrive. Let me, lemme take that back. show up and survive. Because to say Thrive means that the system was created with me in mind and it never was.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: on that note. You're not there anymore, and this is the exit interview of podcast for black educators, right?

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: I'm not there.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: You're not there. And so the next question is, what was the situation that helped you decide that it was time to do something different?

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: absolutely. So given my background of being in transformational schools and always a school that required a crisis plan, I was not unaware of, and I was not in experience in being in situations where. The stakes are against you or the information is scanned, [00:44:00] but you have to make a decision. So I immediately, once computer science got up and rolling, I was over a new academic area and I was named the director of academics, I went from a one person team to having 86 people under my umbrella across every content area

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Wow.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: at the state level. Which is always fun, Asia. The amount of challenges, the amount of issues, and I'm talking, I'm over everything from high school graduation to figuring out how we're going to do, um, the training and orientation for L-G-B-T-Q-I-A. Students

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Mm-hmm.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: these conversations are everything from legislation and policy. To practice and implementation.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Mm-hmm.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: And I realized about [00:45:00] six weeks into it that I was asked to take over all the academic areas because I was vigilant, but I also was starting to become, be labeled as a vigilante because I kept bringing up what was happening. And there's only one letter difference between vigilant and vigilant because when you're vigilant, you're observing, you understand you're raising the issues, you understand the system, you know how to navigate it. You understand bureaucracy, but you also know how to get urgent change in who to speak to, and it requires this dexterity. But once you start raising the bar, or raising the flag, or ringing the bell on too many things, I. The vigilant got you. The job being vigilante gets you the label of being hard to work with, of being aggressive when you are [00:46:00] simply deeply passionate about a marginalized community or marginalized group of people who you know this policy is not good for them. And remember when I told you if it's your calling or keep calling. I got asked to speak at, so it it, it could be, a back to school conference or it could be a, a leadership summit people would say, can you come speak for the, I, I can't because I'm in a role that is a state funded role.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: And so that's where the Limitless leader, which started out as the Limitless ladies came from. would work on my business in the evening not knowing that I was planting seeds for my future, when the nos to purpose started to outweigh the yeses to a system that wasn't designed for me in [00:47:00] mind. I had so much energetic debt in me that the work wasn't enjoyable anymore.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Mm-hmm.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: I, I had learned the system so well that I could go through. making change, I was making impact, but it wasn't necessarily hard, fulfilling, or as deeply impactful as I thought it would be. And in 2022, January, I had to make a decision and I said to myself, what would happen if I make an exit strategy? To leave this role and literally live off of what I could make in my company.

Because when you have been 22 plus years and you know at the end of the month you are gonna get paid

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Every month consistently. Yeah.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: when you know that your insurance covered, like [00:48:00] boom,

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: Like you have to plan for that. You have to do a mindset shift for that. I. And I was no longer in a space where me being vigilant was enough.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Mm-hmm.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: And I had, time, I'm getting older I had become really comfortable with not being a vigilante the way they labeled me, but I was okay being a disruptor.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: And I knew that the system was not designed for disruptors. So what I say to people now who are thinking about making a shift and make, especially women of color, I say a lot of times that the safest place for a woman of color to work is for herself

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Say it again. Say it again. Nope. Say it again.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: Like for a woman of color to work is for herself.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: And away from those [00:49:00] mental systems allowed Mary to show up, not necessarily Dr. Hemphill. Mary got to answer the questions, not Dr. H. Mary got to create what she would've wanted when she was in the seat of professional learning, not what the state wanted me to do.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: And as I built, built, April one will be six years of the limitless leader, and going from solopreneur to now being S-corp with two and a half employees full-time and one part-time. It showed me that creativity is medicine and the system I was in. Not only didn't allow me to be as creative as I needed to be, I wasn't as creative as I wanted to be in bringing people what I knew was [00:50:00] going to be different and not, not to say the best or perfect, but I knew it was gonna be impactful so that who students would win.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: The closer I get. 'cause every day I feel like I'm growing every day. As a business person, I'm learning Every day. When I step on the stage or when I do a workshop and I'm honing, my craft is literally, creativity was the medicine I needed and the system literally was trying to keep me from being my best creative self.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: All right. Listen, we could do this all day, but you got a class to teach. I'm gonna cut my interview down, unfortunately.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: No,

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: ' cause you you are busy. You listen.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: We have more time. You're good? You're good.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: I'm sweating over here.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: no, no, no, no, no. I can stay till six 15. You're good.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Okay folks. She said I got 20 minutes. Um, so, and I love that you're, you're talking [00:51:00] about this and it makes sense for us too. Then I guess just can you just keep sharing about. What you're doing right now. I know I'm skipping around in my questions, but you're already there, so tell us about your work.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: Yes, so what I love deeply about what I do is I have the opportunity to, and let me back up. In the systems I had learned, it looked a lot of times like asking for permission.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Sure,

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: Can I go to the doctor?

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: sure.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: wait for somebody to give you permission.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: May I please take a vacation with my family, and you wait for permission. And so my human doing was top notch. I'm good. can do all the things there. I know how to show up. I know how to do those things. My human being was suffering. And I just told you, my parents are older, [00:52:00] so I'm not only missing time with them. I mean, even health wise, 90 hour weeks do not a creative leader make because 90 hour weeks means I'm always bargaining for rest. You gave me an incredible deck when we met the rest deck. Had you met me in the system, rest deck might have been opened. This fall,

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Mm.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: because I'm in a space now where I'm autonomous in navigating the responsibility of my freedom, I have used that rest deck every single weekend and pulled out one thing on Sunday that I do to intentionally rest for myself.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah. Shout out to Trisha Sey, by the way, for that rest deck and all her work at the NAP ministry. If you all don't know about her and her work, check her out. Um, she's on, uh Instagram. She's everywhere. The [00:53:00] NAP ministry, NAP Nap, continue.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: It is so good IT

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah, it is good.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: so much for that. It was such a beautiful and thoughtful gift. And when I think about what I do now in terms of being a multi-level facilitator, so we do keynotes, workshops, coaching and consulting, and retreats. leaders within corporate, within education as solopreneurs entrepreneurs to connect their human being with their human doing.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Mm-hmm.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: Because when you connect those two things, you have limitless potential. And Asia, I had been limited. People often ask me, where did the limitless leader come from? a life of being limited.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Mm-hmm.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: From a life of being limited,

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: having to ask permission, from figuring out a system [00:54:00] that was designed for, um, someone who did not look like me, someone who did not have my background from watching the rich history that I came from, lose the respect we started off with when it came to. There was a time when the parents, guardians, and community, if the teacher said it law,

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: I was watching all of that walk out the door.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: once you've been limited for so long, you know exactly what that feels like. And so people say, what's your avatar? And immediately have you been limited? In your personal and professional career, is your narrative been limited by what was said to you by what was done to you by questions people didn't ask you or the opportunities they didn't advocate for you for? the case, you're my [00:55:00] people

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah. Thank you so much. Yeah, continue. Go ahead. Go ahead.

dr--mary-hemphill---ceo---founder-of-the-limitless-leader--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_170533: no, no. Just because at this point. Whether it's a keynote, whether it's a workshop, whatnot, or what have you, the human being part of it, and I'm not talking about just emotional intelligence. We have overused and we have miscalculated what emotional intelligence really is in its power.

dr--asia-lyons--she-her-_1_03-25-2025_150533: Yeah. [00:56:00]

Yeah.

Yeah. [00:57:00]

Yeah.

And it's so beautiful, isn't it?

Yeah. It's so

listen. I describe it also as an entrepreneur. I love that term. That's, I'm gonna, I'm gonna borrow that. 'cause teachers don't steal. We borrow if, if I, I imagine it as whatever, like you just said, whatever. I imagine whatever the ancestors drop into my spirit to do. I get to do.

[00:58:00] Yeah. Yeah.

Mm. We don't have time for you to start. You said I got, you said I got until six 15. Stop playing. You not gonna sit here and drop a gym and I'm look at the clock and I got 12 minutes and I got 75 more questions. You, we gonna have No, you're right. Yeah. Oof.[00:59:00]

Yeah, yeah, yeah,

yeah. Yeah.

Yeah.[01:00:00]

Yeah. [01:01:00]

Yeah.

Yes.

Yeah.[01:02:00]

Yeah.

Yes, I got you. I am sitting here processing everything you're saying right now. This is fantastic. Yeah. Yes, I do.

Yeah.

Yeah.[01:03:00]

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Absolutely. Thank you so much for that. I think I'm going to, in my time I have left, I'm gonna ask you a question I asked you before when we met, but I think that more folks should hear your answer, and that is for you, what does it mean to be, well,[01:04:00]

go ahead. Just go ahead.

Mm-hmm.[01:05:00]

Hmm.

Yeah.[01:06:00]

Yeah. Yeah.

Listen, listen. Don't listen.

I know you serious. I know you serious. And you, yeah. You say that so beautifully that the ways that you can see that. You can see it in the ways that school districts create affinity group spaces, how they run them. How they have wellness programs that do not have them, how they [01:07:00] have exit interviews, how they do not all with their lens in mind, only their perspective in mind, only their people in mind only.

Um, and so we do have a lot of black folks who are not well and are still in education, trying their best to show up for our children and for their colleagues and are just not well. And the folks who leave and they're going to nonprofit or going to be an entrepreneur are doing something else and are still not well.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Have to leave it here folks, because, um, we gonna have to just close the computer up on me. Um, if people need to find you.

If they wanna reach out and work with you, how can they find you?

[01:08:00] Yes, she is, folks.

Awesome. Alright, folks, this has been another fantastic episode of the Exit interview, a podcast for black educators. Thank you so much for listening, and we hope to see you again. Peace.